Benjamin Barber

[meadow]

tele wrote:
"Vote?  We
don't need no stinkin' votes! I am the Mullah/chief Poobah around here and
what I say goes...and that's it! I serve the gruel up at 7:00 and shut up! "

sound familiar?
just wondering,
d

telebob x wrote:

> I cannot argue with the sentiments expressed by Benjamin Barber.  He is
> right of course.  What needs to be exported from the USA (and what needs to
> be enhanced within the USA) is a sense of individual (and especially
> corporate) responsibilty toward what is considered the "public good."
> Darwinian business practices have to be ameliorated by a balancing rule of
> law that is equitably distributed.  Few of the undeveloped nations where we
> export our manufacturing for example have strong governments dedicated to
> some/any concept of "public good."  These governments exist mainly to
> enforce and legitimize ruling power structures.  Their idea of government is
> not to increase the common wealth, but to increase personal wealth of those
> in power. No wonder companies are attracted to these areas.  Cheap labor,
> bribable local officials, first class hotels at bargain rates, this is the
> best of all possible worlds.
>
> My argument with Jon was that demonizing the US as an energy and resource
> hog, is a pink herring, since we do use a lot of the energy and resources to
> make products that are then re-exported to the rest of the world. It makes
> the stats more skewed to appear that we are consumers only of the worlds
> resources.  Do we get the lions share?  Certainly it is disproportionate,
> but nothing lies like statistics badly interpreted.
>
> I have always thought that a basic course in ethics should be a part of the
> business school curriculum...just so the young MBA's that are turned out
> have some passing acquaintence with the concept.
>
> But how we export a concept of rule of law equitably distributed is a
> tougher sell, since the people such a thing would benefit are not
> necessarily those in power.  It is easy to export greed and avarice, fair
> play is harder, especially for cultures where 'fairness and justice' is a
> foreign idea.
>
> One of the great cultural clashes that is going on has that rivalry at its
> very base.  The Islamic cultures are ones that are based on the rule of men
> and not of law. (Tribal style councils who settle disputes by
> mandate...rather than juries of peers with clear cut laws).  Beyond the
> psycho-sexual aspects as described in Jaxon's post, is the 'rage' engendered
> by the threat the radical fundamentalists (read patriarchal male dominated
> cultures) feel toward their own traditional power structures.  Vote?  We
> don't need no stinkin' votes! I am the Mullah/chief Poobah around here and
> what I say goes...and that's it! I serve the gruel up at 7:00 and shut up!
> These are father types that remind me of Rodney Daingerfield in "Natural
> Born Killers"....
>
> Oh well...and good morning to you too....
>
> Kisses,
>
> tele
>
> >From: "Jon Ford" <jonmfordster@hotmail.com>
> >To: austin-ghetto-list@pairlist.net
> >Subject: Benjamin Barber
> >Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2001 15:46:35 -0800
> >
> >Barber is a fine thinker. Note what he says below (from the article Wayne
> >sent us), and note that what he is saying is pretty close to what I was
> >saying (perhaps not clearly enough) a week or so ago in my exchange with
> >Bob-- we need to think about what we export to foreign countries, and add
> >some real values to the "value added" of our products!
> >
> >Jon
> >
> >
> ><The underlying theme in all his work is democracy -- how to strengthen
> >it, export it, describe the variations found in different countries.
> >Neither the extremists of "Jihad" nor the capitalists that make up
> >"McWorld" are serving democracy, he argues, because both evade or ignore
> >the process.
> >
> >"I said precisely that the war of Jihad versus McWorld, if it was not
> >alleviated by global democracy, an international civic infrastructure,
> >was likely to explode. These two sets of forces could not avoid clashing
> >and exploding; they were going to create nothing but death and explosion
> >unless we did this third thing, and we didn't.
> >
> >"The question is: Will we now? Will we now acknowledge the
> >interdependence that has been demonstrated? Will we make interdependence
> >not just a matter of AIDS and global warming and weapons destruction and
> >terrorism, but will we make it a matter of global civic and political
> >institutions? I think there are inducements that were not there before.
> >
> >"On September 10, when I talked about global democracy, people thought,
> >'What a quaint, charming utopian that guy Barber is.' On September 12,
> >they were saying what a political realist that guy is."
> >
> >Barber talks about a new "declaration of interdependence," which
> >acknowledges that "no one nation can experience prosperity and plenty
> >unless others do, too." America is a reluctant power, he says, and in
> >this reluctance it communicates indifference and arrogance to other
> >nations.
> >
> >"We want to be loved, to be understanding, to be sensitive, whereas what
> >the world wants from us is to use our power to construct a global system
> >that will let them take care of themselves. They don't need our
> >sympathy, they don't want our sensitivity, they want a fair system that
> >gives them a fair shake. Our sentimentalism sometimes gets in the way.
> >We want to be "liked," you see what I'm saying? We are a very big
> >elephant that thinks it's a large pussycat."
> >
> >Multinational corporations tend to prefer to operate in countries that
> >impose few limits on their operations, Barber says. Those tend to be
> >countries with anarchic, weak or corrupt governments, which also provide
> >a fertile breeding ground for terrorists. Although in this country
> >capitalism has thrived within the "container" of regulation and civil
> >society, America has failed to export or promote similar restraints
> >overseas. "If we export capitalism without democracy, we breed anarchy
> >and terrorism," he says.
> >
> >"It's now a matter of national security. Part of the war on terrorism
> >has to be to address the conditions that produce terrorism, and that has
> >become a matter of necessity and not some intellectual vision of what a
> >good world is. The hidden silver lining in this hideous, desperate
> >terrorist act is the sense of what wonderful punishment for the
> >terrorists -- if what they actually did was prompt us toward a more
> >civic and democratic world. Imagine how upset they'd be!"
> >
> >
> >
> >
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