Unwinnable wars, etc.

[Bill Irwin]

Well, I didn't have any other statements did I?  Sometimes Roger is a little
loose with the facts.
Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Ford <jonmfordster@hotmail.com>
To: <billi@aloha.net>; <rcbaker@eden.infohwy.com>
Cc: <austin-ghetto-list@pairlist.net>
Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2001 1:46 PM
Subject: Re: Unwinnable wars, etc.


> Good point about the straits, Bill-- but what did you think about the rest
> of Roger's response? Overall,I didn't think he was far off the mark!
>
> Jon
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: "Bill Irwin" <billi@aloha.net>
> >To: "Roger Baker" <rcbaker@eden.infohwy.com>
> >CC: <austin-ghetto-list@pairlist.net>
> >Subject: Re: Unwinnable wars, etc.
> >Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 09:29:06 -1000
> >
> >Roger wrote:
> >Need we be reminded that one supertanker sunk in the Straits of Hormuz
> >  by bin Laden's crew could bottle up Saudi exports for months.
> >
> >Not exactly true Roger. The Strait of Hormuz is 25 miles wide so would
take
> >a hell of a lot of sunken tankers to block it.  25 miles is a little to
far
> >for most artillery, missiles could do it but I would think the Air Force
> >would be all over them.  Iran would have to enter the war and threaten
> >tankers with missile attacks which would cause the insurance companies to
> >cancel their shipping policies and with no insurance tankers would stay
> >away.  Short of Iran entering the war I don't think there is any way to
> >block the Strait of Hormuz.  For a chart of the Strait see this link.
> >http://gulf2000.columbia.edu/reference/hormuz.html
> >Ewie
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: Roger Baker <rcbaker@eden.infohwy.com>
> >To: <austin-ghetto-list@pairlist.net>
> >Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2001 12:45 PM
> >Subject: Unwinnable wars, etc.
> >
> >
> > >
> > > "...this may be happening again, Bush having
> > > signed off for the military to conduct an
> > > unwinnable war..."
> > >
> > > Gratifying to see how quickly Mikey evolves from a fervent supporter
of
> > > Bushwar as a means of slaughtering Arab evildoers to a doubter --
toward
> > > one who even suggests that bin Laden has snookered us into a trap with
> > > the help of conditioned reflex Pentagon power-junkies.
> > >
> > > If Mike stumbles into the obvious, can the rest of the public be far
> > > behind?
> > >
> > > Terrorism is a symptom (of decades of class oppression with the help
of
> > > the CIA, the Pentagon. etc.) and not the disease.  To me this is a
> > > fascinating case of religion as a proxy for class conflict.
> > >
> > > Since Bush can't admit that his real underlying motivations are
> > > nationalist corporate interests defined by the Chaney crowd, George
has
> > > to spin the war as a quasi-religious war of "Infinite Justice" against
> > > "evildoers" in many unspecified countries.
> > >
> > > Evildoers are Bushspeak for the growing alliance of typically Islamic
> > > victims of the corporate empire -- who are finally forming efficient
> > > alliances capable of fighting back, thanks to CIA help and training.
And
> > > in accord with the classic behavior of tribal apes throughout history,
> > > all sides march behind flags and religious banners to conceal the
class
> > > interests that really motivate their efforts.
> > >
> > > Amazing about this war is fast it is wearing thin as the public reads
> > > the paper and realizes it is unwinnable and how rapidly it has
> > > re-energized the peace movement.  It helps that Bush utters pure
> > > gibberish changing day by day about the details -- like who we are
> > > fighting and to what ends.
> > >
> > > History repeats itself first as tragedy and then as farce, which
recalls
> > > the rather more successful efforts of George Senior in his Gulf War of
> > > 1990 (?).
> > >
> > > But this time, the international bourgeoisie found it easy to imagine
> > > themselves in an office in the WTC and appeared initially united
behind
> > > kicking bin Laden's ass.  But the international brotherhood of the
> > > wealthy is weak glue when it comes to national squabbling over Persian
> > > Gulf oil.
> > >
> > > Need we be reminded that one supertanker sunk in the Straits of Hormuz
> > > by bin Laden's crew could bottle up Saudi exports for months. Or that
> > > world oil production will peak well within the decade and the price
will
> > > then soar, despite the world economic slump reducing oil  price at the
> > > moment due to demand falling below amount Arabia wants to sell to prop
> > > up its monarchy.
> > >
> > > Way it looks to me, anyhow. -- Roger
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
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