[AGL] all colors plus black and white

[Frances Morey]

Jon,
  So what do you have against air brush? Just kidding. At the McNey in San Antonio there was a painting/sculpure by Michael Tracey. On the description card beside the work the media listed along with acrylic paint, rope, and canvas was the word "seaman." It was said that he sometimes mixes it into the paint or simply applies it directly. 
  Frances

Jon Ford <jonmfordster at hotmail.com> wrote:
  Bill-- I think we agree exactly on this subject, so arguing would not be 
fruitful. I would say though that those who apply paint like a" 
housepainter," without leaving brushstrokes (possibly just spraying it on ), 
may be doing so to show that artists can use the techniques of the 
industrial age effectively; that art doesn't have to embrace the "organic 
nature" paradigm to be aesthetically appealing. I don't have any trouble 
with this so long as the artist doesn't bad-mouth or claim to be left cold 
by art that does something else, such as integrating materials and artifacts 
from the organic "crafts" palette in contrast to stainless steel and 
sprayed-on automobile enamel, for instance. To enjoy a work of art we need 
to have some understanding of the aesthetics and materials preferences of 
the artist, then see if it the work can somehow create pleasure in us or 
bring about some astounding "revisioning" of the world around us, natural 
and/or mechanical and artificial, even toxic perhaps.

Jon



>From: "Bill Irwin" 

>Reply-To: survivors' reminiscences about Austin Ghetto Daze in the 

>60s

>To: "survivors' reminiscences about Austin Ghetto Daze in the 

>60s"

>Subject: Re: [AGL] all colors plus black and white

>Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 17:09:13 -1000

>

>What's wrong with unfruitful discussions? I thought that was what we were

>all about!

>

>What I was trying to get at is that the use of butterfly wings, or any 

>other

>material in a creation, is that materials do in fact have meaning. That is

>why they are used, they don't get in the way as Mike says, they are part of

>the message. A popular quote -"the medium is the Message". Oil paint is a

>material and somebody that knows how that works can do wonders, I am

>thinking of Van Gough here in the way he applied his pigments. His craft 

>of

>the brush stroke and use of the pigment to create a surface effect added to

>his message and enhances the emotional effect. I see many painters that

>paint like house painters - they carefully mix up the color and apply it to

>the area in a nice even manner, then for the next color area they do the

>same. Their craft of the brush stroke is non-existent and they seem to

>think that the paint itself has no connotations. For those people I say go

>study Van Gough or Chinese brush painting.

>

>A number of years back there was a guy here that did abstract collages 

>using

>dried banana bark and leaves, they were kind of good abstractions and

>regularly got into juried exhibitions. Using the banana leaves gave a

>interesting effect and texture that you could never have gotten with paint.

>Now is this "fine art" or "craft" ? Fine art because it relied on

>composition, color, abstraction, and 2 dimensions. Craft because it used

>banana leaves as the material and depended on the cutting and pasting of 

>the

>material and was about banana leaves to a great extent.

>

>So therefore, I don't agree that paint is better than some other material

>and that the material you do chose to work with does have meanings and that

>is why you use them. Paint has meaning also, particularly to people that

>say painting is the only art form. Many "fine artists" have poor concepts

>when it comes to dealing with craft arts.

>Aloha,

>Ewie

>

>----- Original Message -----

>From: "Jon Ford" 

>

>

> > What Mike is saying might be true for purely abstract painting produced

> > according to a particular ideology of art. However, if you stretch this

>kind

> > of thiking too far, it starts to seem like "my advanced culture is

> > inherently superior to your 'primitive' culture." We could debate about

>this

> > too, but it likely be a rather unfruitful discussion.

> >

> > Jon

> >

> >

> > >From: "Bill Irwin" 

> > >

> > >Clearly you don't have an understanding or appreciation for the craft

>arts

> > >where material is a major point. Also take a look at Chinese brush

> > >painting

> > >where material (ink) and the craft of the brush stroke is a major

> > >consideration.

> > >

> > >----- Original Message -----

> > >From: "Michael Eisenstadt" 

> > > >

> > > > pigment out of a tube is better than feathers or butterfly wings

> > > > because it has no associations and therefore gets in the way of

> > > > the art less.

>

>


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