[Jacob-list] Stolen sheep

[Betty Berlenbach]

Here is the conversation I had via email with Linda and Steve Purdy, fyi
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Betty Berlenbach 
To: purdyvet 
Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: jacobs


Thank you for your reply, Linda.  I appreciate your taking the time to reply.  

My jacobs and shetlands have access to warm water every day and prefer eating snow: the water goes undrunk and freezes, and they eat snow.. Go figure.  I think that the more primitive ones prefer taking care of themselves.

Certainly, 12 pounds is not a good weight for a jacob over 3 months old!  Unless, of course, they were from very primitive ewes, and were born at 3 lbs., which is not unusual, and then 12 lb. at 3 months, is 4 x their birth weight and very respectable.  However, at a year...

Perhaps you know that the "books" are open on jacobs in the JSBA registry.  We are always finding little enclaves of jacobs which haven't been registered.  I was wondering if this is one of those.  It seems inconceivable to me that I haven't run into the owner of 40 "jacob" sheep.  The ones in the photos all looked like Jacobs.  No doubt you know that when a jacob is crossed with another breed, except for dorset and possibly cheviot, the resulting lambs are black sheep, with an occasional white marking, not spotted sheep.  The spotting seems to occur in crosses only in these two aforementioned breeds.  There are many bloodlines of jacobs, however, some from earlier importations, and some from importations in the 70's.  
Those from the 70's were more likely to have been crossed with dorsets in England and are larger, seem to be prone to fatter feet, and white feet, rather than black.  (Though white feet does not necessarily mean crossing.)  The inspectors for JSBA can tell most crossbreds just from a series of photos.  All jacobs registered with the association must be inspected.  

I would love to come and see these sheep, if possible.  I'd also sure like to know where they came from--that is, where the owner got them.  IF they were auction culls, which some of them sure look like, that's one thing, but on the offchance that they are from a strain we don't know about, it is important to our conservation efforts to make every effort to check them out.  Would it be too much to ask if I might come see them?  At your convenience, of course.

Just to warn you, I've had calls from people wondering how you got the sheep, on what authority you are keeping them, if they are/were undernourished, blah,blah, blah: not a lot of calls but maybe 4, and I know at least one other breeder who's had a few.  I think it would be a good public relations thing if I had seen them, and as the VP of JSBA, could reassure people that these animals were being rescued in a way consistent with the care of jacobs and with what it means to be a responsible steward in the world.  However, that is your call.  My position is that I'd like to know if they are common bloodlines or uncommon, and I'd like the jacob's reputation as a hardy, thrifty, self-sufficient to a large extent, sheep to remain intact.  I don't want people getting the idea that these are your garden variety stump-dumb sheep!  And if I can be a voice of communication among breeders and reassure them of your care and responsibility, that would be good, I think.  

Meanwhile, what kind of sheep do you have?  Or have you had?  I have the jacobs, of course, my love, and a few shetlands, along with heritage breeds of turkeys and chickens.  I have spoken with you and STeve, have met Steve, but at some point, it would be nice to meet you.

Sincerely,

Betty Berlenbach
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: purdyvet 
  To: Betty Berlenbach 
  Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 4:08 PM
  Subject: Re: jacobs


  Dear Betty,
  Steve has let me reply to this email because of my experience with sheep.  First, let me clarify that the article somewhat misquoted.  The sheep are not eating ten bales a day.  Nor are they shut in the barn.  The picture was for the paper.  They have run in sheds, and, as you point out, they like to remain outside as much as they can.  Let me clarify also, that I agree with you that Jacobs are very hardy, but these had no food, no water, not even a rock or a windrow.  Even Jacobs need water.  I'm Scottish and I know that in the Highlands, there are flocks that are kept outside year round.  The people who keep their sheep like this are not considered good shepherds and the mortality rate of the lambs is high under these conditions.  I suspect some of these Jacobs are purebred, but there are many crosses in with them as well and there has been absolutely no attention to a breeding program whatsoever.  I'm not sure yet who is pregnant and when they are due, but I'm slowly getting it sorted out.  Jacobs are "lighter" than many of the more commercially raised sheep, but I've got three stunted lambs for sure.  They are nearly a year and weigh 12 pounds.  I think that's a little small even for Jacobs.  Also, all the well tended Jacobs I've ever known have had their ribs covered.  Not fat, but decently covered.  Also, these sheep were very lethargic when they came.  They did not respond as they should, alert and bright.  After nearly a month, they have at last been calling back when we call to them, butting heads, and skipping.  Parasites isn't a problem, but I believe strongly and always have in vaccinations because I have seen far more good come with vaccinating than not.  I am a farm girl, grew up on a dairy farm, and have had sheep for a long time.  I respect your concern and surely, if more people were as concerned as yourself, we wouldn't have the problems we do with these animal hoarders, animal abusers, and ignornance in general.
  Thank you for your comments,
  Linda Purdy
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Betty Berlenbach 
    To: Stephen R. Purdy, DVM 
    Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 8:52 AM
    Subject: jacobs


    Dear Steve,

    I saw the article on the jacob sheep in the Rutland Herald and am very concerned about those sheep you have.  As a board member of the Jacob Sheep Breeders Assoc., and as a jacob breeder, I voice my concerns to you.  I am happy to come over and inspect the sheep myself, for my observations are based on my knowledge of the breed, the descriptions of the newsreporter of their treatment, which I realize may be prejudiced, and the photo in the paper.

    First, Jacobs are PRIMITIVE sheep.  They differ greatly from standardized breeds in many ways.  First, when their backbones feel like the backbones of standardized breeds when they are starving, jacobs are VERY healthy.  If their backbones feel like those of healthy standardized breeds, they are way overweight, terribly unhealthy, probably won't breed, and being abused.  Primitive sheep have an entirely different set of standards for healthiness.  Secondly, these are sheep that live all year long out on the hills of northern Scotland, their only "shelter" being windrows or rocks.  They are very happy in that atmosphere, apparently, are hardy, and healthy in snow up to their backs.  My jacobs have the option of sleeping in a shed or outside: the only time they go into the shed is when it is sleeting or hailing or frozen rain-ing.  They love sleeping out in the snow, and when I come out in the a.m., shake themselves off, stand up, and look for hay.  Thirdly, my very healthy jacobs, at one year old, are about 35-40 pounds.  These are March/April lambs.  Those born in January, for whatever reason (lower parasite load, need to gain faster because of the cold...) are often closer to 50 pounds at one year.  THIS is NORMAL.  Lambs who have been force fed or over fed, given a lot of grain or very rich hay, grow too quickly, and this is not healthy for them.  Primitives generally take a full two years to reach normal size.  Forthly, normal size is 85 pounds to maybe 95.  If they are over 110 or so pounds, they are not registerable, for they are really not purebred PRIMITIVE jacobs.  They grow most healthily on mother's milk.  I have put creep feed out, and the only ones who will eat it are the ones who come from much larger mothers, which, I suspect, are from later importations and are somewhat standardized.  

    Next, jacobs are very thrifty: they thrive very well on 2-3 pounds of hay per day.  $2.00-$2.50 a bale hay.  Richer hay isn't good for them.  (Speaking of which, I haven't lost a lamb in six years, and have assisted at 2 deliveries in that time.  Generally, I breed between 10-18 ewes a year.  That should tell you something of the health of my sheep.  ALso, I might add, I DO NOT get up in the night to check on them.  They basically have their lambs unassisted.)  For them to be eating 10 bales of hay seems very unhealthy to me.  

    Jacobs, also, FYI, have an incredible resistance to parasites.  I worm twice a year.  I know breeders who never worm.  The sheep are fine.

    Last but not least, the photo shows a bunch of sheep crowded into a very close area.  That is far more unhealthy for primitive sheep than out in a snowstorm.  These sheep are genetically used to wide open spaces, not close quarters.

    You probably think I'm full of shit, and very cheeky to challenge this article.  However, the bad name that these sheep have gotten as a breed from that article really bothers me.  THESE are NOT regular ol' stump dumb sheep who have to be mollycoddled. THey are highly intelligent,  they defend themselves (mine beat up a pit bull once who broke into the paddock), very self sufficient, hardy, quite incredible animals.  Also, I've hauled them all over the countryside, as have most of the breeders I've spoken with about this subject, without "shots" and with no shipping fever or any other effect from travel, summer, fall, winter, or spring, so long as they were not stuffed into an enclosed space--which I think is cruelty to animals and abuse.  I would challenge any person with jacob sheep who shut them into a barn: that, I believe IS abuse.

    Perhaps this person in Springfield who had them panicked, pershaps she is unaware of the history and genetic makeup of these sheep, and should never have called you to begin with.  (I suspect she might not know the treasure she has, because I have no idea who she is, and I know most jacob breeders around.) Perhaps I am totally wrong, have misread the article, you did a doctorate in primitive northern Scottish sheep, and I'm out of line.  If so, I'm terribly sorry.  I applaud your efforts to be helpful to abused domestic animals, but I think it is important to know what it is one is dealing with when rescuing them.

    Please let me know if I can be of any service to you in evaluating the health of these animals.  

    Sincerely,
    Betty Berlenbach, 802-263-9345

    P.S. These attributes of primitive sheep also apply to shetlands, though I find them not as hardy or thrifty as jacobs, soays, and other British rugged island sheep, who, when there isn't enough scrubby food to scavenge, wade in the sea and eat seaweed.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.pairlist.net/pipermail/jacob-list/attachments/20030322/89fcf4e7/attachment.html