[Jacob-list] Re: butting rams

[Betty Berlenbach]

ah, but Katherine, it was a ram IN WITH THe EWES who was doing the bashing.
I would guess the frustration is that all the ewes are settled and he's "not
getting any." and separating him out, away from the ewe smell would relieve
the situation.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Katherine Wisor" <creeksendfarm at mac.com>
To: "Melody" <critterland at bendcable.com>
Cc: <jacob-list at jacobsheep.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] Re: butting rams


>   Is it possible that these rams are showing /displaying signs of
> frustration?   I have never separated rams from  their ewes and have
> never in over 30 years of raising sheep  have never seen a ram  be
> violent toward inanimate objects or people .   I have 4 rams in the
> pasture now and none of them  are destructive  or mean , even toward
> strangers.   Dogs are aggressive when tied up all the time, cats stop
> using there litter box when not cleaned , is it possible aggression in
> sheep is also out of frustration toward what they feel is an  unnatural
> condition when separated ?   If they aren't worth breeding I neuter
> them but never separate them .....
>   Just a thought....  >Katherine
>   On Dec 9, 2004, at 3:48 PM, Melody wrote:
>
> > My ram has started really bashing things in the last year (he is now
> > 3).  A
> > real sweetie with me but has almost demolished one side of the chicken
> > house, broke off the upright timber by the door of his shed
> > (fortunately the
> > other uprights are still holding) and has done major damage to trees by
> > butting and hooking them with his horns. He and his wether buddy had
> > about
> > half an acre to themselves when this started, and I had put in some
> > "sheep
> > toys".  I thought it might stop when I put him in with the ewes, and
> > it has
> > to some extent, but he has still all but taken down a couple of
> > smaller
> > juniper trees in the ewe pasture.   I keep threatening him but he
> > doesn't
> > listen .  I'm going to show him my recipe for mutton stew, up close and
> > personal, if he isn't careful!
> > Melody at CritterLand
> > Redmond OR
> >
> > Linda wrote
> > I had a ram like that.  He was pretty good until he turned two.  He
> > had, in
> > his growing up years, made threatening
> > moves towards me.  I kept throwing water in his face until he quit that
> > behaviour.  But, he then got more and more
> > aggressive towards any structure.   You couldn't even walk by outside
> > the
> > fence if you were carrying a board without
> > him charging the fence.  He wouldn't charge people walking by unless
> > they
> > were carrying something.  He put holes in
> > every wall he could reach.  I made him a special shelter where he
> > didn't
> > have access to the sides.  It had a low roof
> > and he began to charge the roof.  That was a sight. He spent his last
> > few
> > months with us standing in the rain.  He was
> > with his ewes when the behaviour started, so I can't say that he was
> > bored
> > or lonely.  He managed to tear one of the
> > doors off the trailer on the way to the butcher.  Then managed to
> > knock a
> > board almost off the bull pen at the
> > butchers.
> >
> > I wish I could come up with a remedy other than mine.  This ram got
> > progressively worse.  I got him soccer balls to
> > beat up on, threw in metal garbage cans for him to vent on, nothing
> > ever did
> > even slow him down.
> >
> > Just a note:  I have not seen a higher percentage of aggressive
> > behaviour in
> > his descendants.  In fact, some have been
> > among the mellowest.
> >
> > Linda
> >
> > On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 13:06:11 -0500, Donnangelo,Nicholas C. wrote:
> >> My wife and I have a small flock of one breeding group so we generally
> >> separate the ram from the ewes in September (we are in northern
> >> Virginia)
> > and
> >> keep the ram with the ewes until lambing when we remove him again for
> >> a
> > month
> >> or so.   Anyway our ram - who is now running with the ewes has become
> >> increasingly destructive; butting our run in shed until one of the 4x4
> >> uprights was actually broken and the structure near collapse.  I
> >> repaired
> > that
> >> and now he knocked a hole in the plywood wall of the shed.  There is
> >> no
> > sign
> >> of aggression to any of the other Jacobs, or two full size donkey's
> >> we run
> >> with them (although he will take hay from the donkey's at will;
> >> they'll pin
> >> their ears at him but he is clearly top dog), or with us.  Horses
> >> will get
> >> into trouble if they are bored...  has anyone else had this problem?
> >> recommendations?  Thanks Nick
> >>
> >>
> >>
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