[Jacob-list] Copper DEFINCIENCY

[Robin Lynde]

I had a lamb this year with symptoms similar to those you described and I saw in your video when this lamb was born. I call it the "wobbly lamb" syndrome. in this case it seemed to be whole body, not just front or back end, as I've sometimes seen before. I was talking to the vet about other issues but asked about this lamb. One thought was oxygen deficiency at birth as can happen in a difficult birth. I was trying to remember (but with 70+ lambs in 3 weeks I wasn't clear on all the birth details !) and I think this was one that I found partly out of it's yearling mom and she was walking around before she got it out all the way. So it's very likely that it was a birth problem. Anyway, I made sure it got colostrum and kept the mom and lamb in a jug for several days. Later I kept them in a pen with just a few ewes and lambs so it wouldn't have to deal with all the rest of the flock. The lamb didn't get any better and eventually I put it down.

As for copper--A few years ago, two years in a row, I had a ewe die within 2-4 weeks of lambing. Each time the ewe got very weak and lost interest in food and within about 24 hours she died. Necropsies showed copper toxicity. It turns out that these two ewes were mother and daughter and I don't have any more of their offspring here.  I've never had any others with copper toxicity and I thought it was interesting that these were closely related. I never could figure out a source of copper--I don't feed grain (other than enough COB to get them to learn to like grain as lambs so they will all run to the barn when I shake the bucket). I have only sheep salt out, etc. 

My understanding is that blood copper levels in healthy sheep don't mean much because it's only when the liver gets an overload of copper than it finally "dumps" into the blood and the animal gets very sick and dies. Or the liver is building up high levels and then additional stress (lambing, etc) causes the excretion of the copper in the blood.  Otherwise the liver keeps building up the copper but you don't see evidence in the blood. That's one reason that a necropsy of a sheep that dies of something else can be useful if it shows copper building up in the liver.

Robin Lynde
Meridian Jacobs
Vacaville, CA 
www.meridianjacobs.com 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: gotothewhip at aol.com 
  To: patchworkfibers at alltel.net ; jacob-list at jacobsheep.com 
  Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 7:17 AM
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] Copper DEFINCIENCY




  Linda, if folks send me a reply privatley, I will relay the info to you without their name.....But I cant imagine anyone being embarrased about this as it is truly a freak ordeal, and as the vet said, usually occurs in flocks that are well tended to, as we are feeding the correct thing to our sheep in feed and mineral form.

  The info on this is not really current,  so I was hoping to get some experienced shepards's stories.

  I lso have learned that our breed is LIKELY very tolerant to copper levels....It appears the more selectivley bred the breed is, the more susceptable they are to toxicity from the copper... Down Breeds (Mostly the common meat breeds) are VERY sensitive as are te Texel a HEAVILY muscled meat breed from the Netherlands)   Finewools tend to me a bit more tolerant, and Finnsheep are Highly tolerant.  Obviously we have no data on minor breeds such as ours.

  I believe I am going to have copper levels piulled on a few more lambs to determine if I need to give a copper injection, as problems can show up late as well.

  THe simple answer is my hay may be high in Molybendum, which may be tying up the available copper for the minimum needs of the sheep

  Jennifer Tucker
  Moose Mtn Ranch
   



  -----Original Message-----
  From: Linda <patchworkfibers at alltel.net>
  To: gotothewhip at aol.com
  Cc: jacob-list at jacobsheep.com
  Sent: Sat, 18 Apr 2009 4:43 am
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] Copper DEFINCIENCY


  I don't have any input on the copper deficiency, but I would appreciate if replies would publicly to the list as I am also interested in the subject.

  Linda

  gotothewhip at aol.com wrote: 
    The OCD suspect lamb spent most of the day, and most of our life's savings at Colorado State Vet School Yesterday.  We left with an "Open" (Unknown) diagnosis, with bloodwork for Border's Disease (Hairy Shaker Lamb) and Copper levels pending.  Radiologists found no abnormalties in the skull, neck or spinal process.  They Ultrasounded his brain and it was normal as well.  We flt as responsible breeders , more for the sake of the breed and our flock, we needed answers about what is going on here... and if this was a genetic problem (which we have for the most part ruled out)

    The Clinician is going to get with me tomarrow as the Copper levels apperared to be deficient in thi lamb.  He is still progressing.. but still falling down from time to time (several times per day) and also has seizure like fits rarely.

    On the copper DEFICIENCY (not toxicity) any input?

    Jennifer Tucker
    Moose Mtn Ranch
    Bennett, CO



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