[Retros] Solicitation for themes for WCCT-12 Section H

Wed Jan 29 11:53:11 EST 2025

Dear all,

-          In the latest two WCCTs, where there has been a Retro section
for orthodox proof games, the number of entries in the retro section has
outnumbered the amount of threemovers, moremovers and endgames. This will
probably not be seen again, if proof games are excluded from the
competition.

-          One aspect, not perhaps mentioned so far, will be the challenge
for judging if all types of retros are accepted in the competition. Who
wants and is able to judge AntiAdverseAndernachCirceProcaRetractors with
neutral pieces?

-          Possibility for tactics: if I were a country good at all types
of retro problems, I would vote for the most uncommon and unpopular type /
theme, because there is the least competition. Why vote for proof games,
where the quality and quantity is high, and the competition is fiercer?

Best wishes

Per

On Wed, 29 Jan 2025 at 17:36, andrew buchanan <andrew at anselan.com> wrote:

> Hi Andriy,
>
> That's great then. Let the most popular idea win out.
>
> Thank you,
> Andrew
>
> On Wednesday, January 29, 2025 at 07:48:50 PM GMT+8, Andrey Frolkin <
> afretro at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Andrew,
>
> To the best of my knowledge, no decision on that issue has been made.
>
> Any retro themes can be proposed. I only remarked that it seems
> unrealistic to find enough composers to submit classical-style or fairy
> retros to Section H. In the previous WCCT, all participating countries
> submitted PG entries, if I am not mistaken.
>
> But I’ve already received a bunch of proposals that include fairy and
> classical-style themes. These proposals will be put to the vote of the
> countries concerned.
>
> Yours,
>
> Andriy
>
> January 29, 2025
>
> ср, 29 янв. 2025 г. в 13:41, andrew buchanan <andrew at anselan.com>:
>
> Hi,
>
> All the other genres will rotate themes.
>
> I'd like to see the retro genre rotate themes in the same way, and I'm ok
> with that subject matter being sometimes classical retro, sometimes PG,
> sometimes fairy retro. It would be good to learn more about these spaces.
> It's not really about winning.
>
> KEY:
> I would like to see the following as a reply here:
> (1) Who made the decision that we must stick to proof games again this
> year.
> (2) A written form of that decision.
> (3) A explanation of why this decision has been made.
>
> I am CCing Marjan here, and hope he can ensure a reply is forthcoming.
>
> Thanks
> Andrew
>
> On Monday, January 27, 2025 at 07:38:07 PM GMT+8, joose norri <
> joose_norri at hotmail.com> wrote:
> I correct myself: defensive retractors are not pure retros. At least it
> can be seen that way, although as we know the best ones have retro
> refutations, and one can also argue about help retractors. But illegal
> clusters are - and so is the legal cluster. (Not that that one is very
> important.)
> Joose
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Retros] Solicitation for themes for WCCT-12 Section H
>
> Dear Andriy, hi all,
>
> I would just point out that the retro field is much wider than that, also
> purely orthodoxically. Illegal clusters, help retractors, defensive
> retractors, many other things, they are fully orthodox.
>
> I remember your articles with Kornilov; I disagree to some extent, because
> it seemed to me that you put too much emphasis on numerical achievement.
> But that is exactly the point on the other hand: the retro field is simply
> too big. As a retro fan I am not so sure whether it was a wise decision to
> have the section after all.
>
> It being a tourney among nation-teams, if there was a classical retro
> theme then not many countries could find composers with any experience. I'm
> all for it; it could serve as an incentive. But potentially it might be
> very barren.
>
> Then, it is conceivably possible to formulate a retro theme and leave it
> open in which genre it is to be expressed. That would naturally be a
> catastrophe. No one on Earth can compare all those things, perhaps Michel
> can...
>
> Best,
> Joose
>
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Retros] Solicitation for themes for WCCT-12 Section H
>
>
> Dear Joose, deal all,
>
> Classical-style retros dominated the scene until the end of the 1980s;
> then a PG boom began; some 10 years later, fairy retros came to prominence.
> Kornilov and I published two articles in *feenschach* in the mid-2000s
> trying to encourage colleagues to prevent the decline of the
> classical-style domain, but the trend towards a retro section almost devoid
> of “classicism” could not be reversed.
>
> To me, and I am sure to quite a few other retro friends, classical style
> was a very special kind of problems engulfed in the magic of OTB chess. I
> don’t think composers like Plaksin, Kornilov, Hazebrouck or me would have
> become retro analysts if retrograde analysis had been associated at that
> time almost exclusively with e.g. Anti-Circe retractors.
>
> Kornilov and I wrote 20 years ago that in some cases judging
> classical-style retros alongside of fairy retros is like judging a runner
> and a motorcyclist as to whose speed is highest.
>
> But of course having three subsections for retros: a) classical style; b)
> PGs; c) fairy retros would require having at least 9 judges (3*3) and that
> is unrealistic.
>
> However, classical-style retroanalysis is far from exhaustion, as proven
> many times by composers like Dmitry Baibikov, Joaquim Crusats, Michel
> Caillaud and some others. I fully agree with Andrew:
>
> *retro is the home for retros - let's keep like that.*
>
> Yours,
>
> Andriy
>
> вс, 26 янв. 2025 г. в 04:36, andrew buchanan <andrew at anselan.com>:
>
> Hi Joose,
>
> I can understand that today PGs dominate some retro spaces. But in the
> long term, non-PG retros may come to prominence again, or new forms of
> non-PG retro may be imagined. Conceptually, retro is the home for retros -
> let's keep like that.
>
> So my strong preference would be to keep Section H as retro, please, even
> though the chosen theme this year is almost certain to be PG.
>
> Thanks for all your work, Andriy & others.
>
> All the best,
> Andrew
>
>
> On Sunday, January 26, 2025 at 01:44:31 AM GMT+8, joose norri <
> joose_norri at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Dear all,
>
> Outside the topic of this post, well slightly,  it's really the time to
> make it plainly a PG section. There is no sense in pretending anymore.
>
> This, not being an official platform, I'll just put this forward. But
> naturally it could be put forward elsewhere too. If it is really wanted
> that it is a retro section, then this should be taken under serious
> consideration; or else it should be admitted that it is impossible to have
> a retro section.
>
> Yours,
>
> Joose Norri
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *Subject:* [Retros] Solicitation for themes for WCCT-12 Section H
>
>
> Dear friends,
>
> At present, efforts are underway to launch WCCT-12 as soon as possible.
> Apparently, Valery Kopyl will be (or has already been) approved as WCCT-12
> Director. To the best of my knowledge, the teams of the Russian Federation
> and Belarus won’t participate again.
>
> I’ve been asked to solicit proposals for Section H themes, to be followed
> by voting on the choice of one theme.
>
> So far, only one proposal has been received, from Romania.
>
> I’ve sent a solicitation for themes for Section H to almost 20 addresses,
> but I believe it makes sense to repeat this solicitation here as well. So
> if you have for Section H themes, please send them to me (preferably with
> at least one example). A possible deadline could be January 31.
>
> This will be followed by voting.
>
> Presumably, a PG theme will again be selected, as there seem to be not
> enough countries where composers publish high-quality classical-style
> retros. Moreover, although fairy retractors are abundant these days, there
> are not many countries where such problems are created. But there is no ban
> on proposing any sort of retro themes.
>
> Yours,
>
> Andrey (Andriy) Frolkin
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