[Retros] Natch 3.0 beta is out

[Pascal Wassong]

Hi Paulo,

Natch is absolutely not done to solve this kind of problems.  It will
take way too much time, and spit out way too much solutions.

Checking if your initial position is legal is easy for anybody used to
solve retrograde problems.  Finding the shortest proof game to your
position is probably not interesting at all.  About 80 or 100 years ago,
this was sometimes done to show that a position is legal.  Nowadays,
nobody does it anymore.

If you intend to publish your problem, the section editor where you will
send it will be able to tell you if your position is legal or not.

Pascal


>>>>> "Paulo" == Paulo Peccin <ppeccin at gmail.com> writes:

  Paulo> Its for a problem I invented. Its a "mate in 2" problem that
  Paulo> requires retro analysis, and I want to check if the starting
  Paulo> position is really reachable in a normal valid game. So I don't
  Paulo> really know how many moves it would require to get there. I
  Paulo> want to find the minimum number of moves possible.

  Paulo> Thanks, Paulo


  Paulo> On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 3:03 PM, Pascal Wassong
  Paulo> <pascal.wassong at free.fr>
  Paulo> wrote:

  >> Hello,
  >> 
  >> thank you for using iNatch and Natch !
  >> 
  >> For iNatch, the version 0.7 has been created for 32 bits machines,
  >> this is a bit outdated.  I suggest using the previous version
  >> 0.6.2, which is a full java version, independant from 32 bits or 64
  >> bits.  Many users (me included) prefer the 0.6.2 version.
  >> 
  >> For Natch, you must provide the number of moves.  It is strange to
  >> want to try Natch on a position without knowing the minimum number
  >> of moves needed to reach it.  You could test the position while
  >> increasing the number of moves at each try.
  >> 
  >> Best wishes, Pascal
  >> 
  >> 
  >> 
  >> >>>>> "Paulo" == Paulo Peccin <ppeccin at gmail.com> writes:
  >> 
  Paulo> Tried to run iNatch, but it does not start in my machine. Java8
  Paulo> installed.  The logs say:
  >> 
  Paulo> !ENTRY org.eclipse.osgi 4 0 2016-07-29 14:45:04.760 !MESSAGE
  Paulo> Application error !STACK 1 java.lang.UnsatisfiedLinkError: no
  Paulo> swt-win32-3320 or swt-win32 in swt.library.path,
  Paulo> java.libary.path or the jar file
  >> 
  Paulo> Also, can I use Natch to find a solution to a position, but I
  Paulo> don't know how many moves it would take to get to that
  Paulo> position?
  >> 
  Paulo> Thanks, Paulo
  >> 
  Paulo> On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Pascal Wassong
  Paulo> <pascal.wassong at free.fr>
  Paulo> wrote:
  >> 
  >> >> Hello all,
  >> >>
  >> >> 19 years after the first version, 7 years after the latest
  >> version, >> a new version of Natch is out.  It is version 3.0 beta.
  >> You can >> download it from http://Natch.free.fr .
  >> >>
  >> >> Previous version already computed the order of some moves.  This
  >> >> was used to eliminate position having cycles in it.  For example
  >> >> Pa2-a8=N-b6*Pa7 and Pa7xb6.  These move orders found for a
  >> position >> are now used when searching for the moves.  For
  >> example, if black >> must play Rh8-e8-e3-c3 and white Pe2-e4, the
  >> wPe2 won't be allowed >> to move before the black rook arrived at
  >> c3.  This improvement >> increase the speed of resolution of many
  >> problems, and makes the >> --watch (-k for short) preaty useless.
  >> >>
  >> >> Many more move orders are also found.
  >> >>
  >> >> A bug has been corrected, where some solutions where not found.
  >> >>
  >> >> A bug has been corrected on Mac, which made the program crash
  >> when >> the hash-tables where full.  I was surprised to learn about
  >> this >> problem so late.
  >> >>
  >> >> There are also minor changes in the output file and when using
  >> the >> visual option.
  >> >>
  >> >> More details about this new version are available in the NEWS
  >> file >> available when you download the beta version.
  >> >>
  >> >> There were many bugs in the numerous alpha version while
  >> developing >> this 3.0 version, which have been found by the
  >> testers, mainly >> Michel Caillaud and Thierry Le Gleuher.  Thanks
  >> to them and to the >> other testers.
  >> >>
  >> >> There may still be bugs in this version.  If you find one, don't
  >> >> hesitate to send it to me.  The informations needed are: - the
  >> >> proof game, being as short as possible, that reproduces the bug;
  >> - >> the expected solution; - the number of the position where the
  >> bug >> occurs, if needed; - a clear description of what is going
  >> wrong.
  >> >>
  >> >> The precompiled version for windows is a 64 bits version.  I
  >> could >> also prepare a 32 bits windows version, if enough people
  >> are >> interested.
  >> >>
  >> >> Happy composing, Pascal >>
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